In this episode of Cubs Out Loud, we get a little dirty as we have another BEAR show (Bear Experience Action Readiness). In preparation of Midwest Bearfest, the guys talk about maintaining your health during a run. From keeping yourself from getting kennel cough to helping in the prevention of run drop, the cubs exchange some fluids information on how to better prepare for your health.
Re: COL441: The Fall of Gay Bars – Jay Yospa: Enjoyed this. I keep an extinct bar list of the places I’ve gone to that are no longer there
YouTube Comment:
Re: COL421: Couples Age Differences – FURinTeeth: 27yrs apart here, together coming up on 15yrs together.
Blog Comment:
Re: COL442: ATNS: Feedback:
Chris: Thank you so much for having this episode! I love that you didn’t sweep it under the rug and called out exclusionary thinking. Done with sass and strength and compassion. Thank you for rocking the boat.
James Butterfield: Hey guys, just ordered my COL shirt! And just to make Jeff happy, I also bought a mug!
J-Mo:
1. I’m glad you like my 12 inch vinyl singles from Janet Jackson and Whitney Houston! I have another wall devoted to Jody Watley, Patti LaBelle, Madonna and Michael Jackson.
2. Sorry about the scoutmaster socks and the sneakers, that’s just something I like, one of my kinks is the BSA uniform (as you’ve previously mentioned, thank you again, BTW, THAT full video is available on the aforementioned xtube)
3. Gary, I’m glad I’ve managed to get back in your good graces, my apologies for anything that might have put you off previously… 🙂
In this episode of Cubs Out Loud, it’s time for another cup of tea as the guys present an All T, No Shade show. This time around, the cubs read and respond to your feedback on some of our most recent episodes. Also, some Thanksgiving leftover conversations and the guys thirsting on some pics.
Jeff: Marriage & Adoption in Stardew and lazy grocery shopping
Damon: I’m Back! ATL and Thanksgiving.
Chester: Banned, Birthday, Visitors, Escape Room
Gary: Recovery Mode Engaged
Feedback:
Facebook Likes:
Mark Wolf
Nick DeCoopman
Drew Littlefield
Bob Green
Boy Quinton
Lovel Trahan (Pugsley’s BF)
Princess Baron
Milady Lyn
Tom Wray
Donnie Royse
Morgan J McChurch
YouTube Subscribers:
Zak Jackson
Brian McGee
Blog Comment:
Re: COL430: TTO: Labor Gay: @twatTUBBS’ comment: “just catching up on this show after I been doing alot of travelin, Im the “cigar at work” guy and it made my day that you liked my post. I watch your show all the time guys, love it and thanks for the shout out. O and to the points broght up about the pics, I am faily built but I am a foodie, it was a great cigar yes. (Alec Bradley) and its not sweat it was oil, those are clips from a vid I made on youtube, let me know if you want the link. TUBBS”
Re: COL437: Old School Bears Online: tnliving’s comment: “Having a different view in some part of one’s personal life shouldn’t disqualify them from being a valued member of a community. Just like we don’t want to be excluded or discriminated from normal civic life because we are gay, we also shouldn’t exclude others based on their political views in general. As with most issues there are plenty of grey areas but being a Donald Trump supporter is not comparable to maybe being a founder of a gay reformation group. Being an active participant in the Westboro Baptist church should probably preclude somebody from being taken seriously leading a gay social group. Being a Republican (even a Trump Republican) certainly should not in my opinion.”
Not an ask but a thanks … It was great to hear you on the latest episode of Cubs Out Loud!! I kinda fan boyed a bit and may have even did a bit of a squeeeee!!!! too!! Thanks for being involved, it was great to hear you share your knowledge, experience and perspective.
Sure, bub! I’m a semi-regular guest host with the boys from@cubsoutloud, and have probably been on eight or ten episodes–including at least three video episodes that are available on their YouTube channel. You can probably find them all using the tag cloud over onthe COL website.
W Bear – Chester:
Rootbeer Pup and Grizzly: You guys are awesome, I love your shows. Keep up the good work. I love listening to you guys when I can.
(We then got into a discussion about cigars from COL436: Smokin’ in the Bears Den
W Bear – Gary:
Cody says “Hey I love your pictures handsome and I relly like your podcast it got me through my weekend cleaning job and now my commute 😉
Yay! Thanks for letting us know. We’re glad it helped you pass the time. 🙂
Show Topic
ATNS: Feedback
Re: COL440: The Klondykes: From [Redacted]: This is NOT a comment of hate, this is a comment of reality……I 1st saw pics of this “contest” on the old (better) Bear Underground site. They were posted by the winner of the “Glitter Bear” title, ya know, the guy who is dolphin smooth and not bear like in any way.. After looking at these very disturbing pictures I simply asked- What do the red\pink stripes stand for then? Of course he replied that he didn’t know and that they were just shades of red and pink. So one can only figure the color stripes stand for the “Klondikes” heavy to lite flow days. The True Bear Community has been being tainted for years and years. This is the straw that breaks the community and welcomes camel toe. Bear means hair, with that in mind I wonder, do these so-called lesbian bears not shave and grow huge bushes?? This entire Bear’s Welcome Everybody thing has gone way too far. There is a line, and the Klondikes are it. Sad to see so many forget their roots.
In show response regarding the colors in the logo: Per our guest Courtney Chesser: “I’m so glad someone asked! The logo was made by local Aly shine. It is a mixture of the bear pride flag and femme flag on our behalf. The pinks are the bear pride “skin” colors translated into shades of pink. Pink is traditionally displayed in the femme pride flag so it’s accepting of all ranges of skin as well as ranges of femininity.”
In this episode of Cubs Out Loud, the cubs take some time to discuss some feedback they received from their recent “Bear Issues” episode. Listen in as they get some insight on the scientific process from a fan and doctoral student. Also, first world problems, gay desserts, and holding the door.
Comment from The BigBoy Project: “yasss another bear channel on youtube, love the channel”
Bear Underground: chubnerdchaser
Weekly Topic
Bear Issues Study Feedback – COL367 episode feedback for discussion
[From Facebook]
Randall: great episode…i have to agree with your points on this “study” that was conducted as i am sure several of us feel it is incomplete and highly inaccurate..sadly misinformation is such a dangerous thing and does not help our community at large or how others perceive our community. Again please keep up the good work and i liked the Down Low topic being brought up..i myself have a story about a straight guy and being his “secret sex” as i am sure most of us in the bear community do
[From Email]
Hi cubs!
I just finished listening to your podcast on bear issues. I also read the journals on Instinct and the Journal of Clinical Nursing. I have been following the scientific literature on bears and their health for some time now and was very excited to see that someone wrote a systematic review! But when I read the Instinct article I was concerned. I was also concerned when I heard your thoughts and heard that you had so many questions. If you allow me, I would like to express my opinion about this issue. This email is going to be long, but bear with me(pun completely intended :P); I’m going to try to make it worth your time.
First, let me tell you why I care about this. I am a doctoral student and my line of research is on health and health disparities (how individual or social characteristics may affect health). I have previously given lectures about the LGBT and bear communities to college students. I have also worked with and for the LGBT community. I also keep my colleagues and faculty aware of the specific health issues that minorities (LGBT, Hispanics, etc.) face. Also, I have published research and served as an independent reviewer of studies and reviews for scientific journals.
When I read the article on Instinct, my academic soul hurt so much. I recently found a great and funny video about this issue and I hope you enjoy it (I know, it is 20 minutes long, but it is sooooo worth it).
I hope I still have your attention after watching the video and would like to address your questions in an organized way so that you feel free to read as much as you can/want/like:
About studies and systematic reviews: Individual studies may contradict each other in some or all aspects. This happens in social science, physics, chemistry, biology, and computer science. As you guys pointed out, the discrepancies could be because of who researchers surveyed or interviewed, where they surveyed them, and other methods. Systematic reviews are a way of bringing all the findings together, making sense of the information at a greater scale, finding patterns, suggesting why results differ, and suggesting improvement in research (and in this case also clinical practice). The usual audience of empirical studies, systematic reviews, and meta-analysis is other researchers or clinicians with similar training. The way other researchers and clinicians interpret these articles is different than someone without the training.
As an analogue, imagine researchers finding that Hispanics have a higher likelihood of having diabetes and hypertension (this is something that has been found repeatedly). I bet someone has interpreted this as “Hispanics are fat and lazy” or “Hispanics are hot heads.” But remember, this is not what the researchers have said. They have identified that Hispanics are at a greater risk for diabetes and hypertension, but the causes are not known (more of that in a bit). The same happened in the systematic review.
About the purpose of the systematic review: I guess it would be good to know the purpose of the systematic review was two-fold: 1) to address possible health disparities among people who identify as bears so that other researchers fine tune future research and 2) motivate other clinicians to improve the health of those who identify as bears. The purpose is not to criticize or stigmatize bears. It is to address the health needs of bears. The authors of the systematic review make that clear while the author of the article in Instinct did not.
About the people studies recruited: It is impossible to recruit every person from the populations we are interested in. Recruitment for studies like the ones mentioned in the review is usually self-selective. We want people to be willing to answer some questions and not everyone has the time or the willingness. The studies cited in the review included men who self-identified as bears through a survey, an interview, or any other form. Some of the studies compared men who identified as bears to other groups like straight men or gay men who did not identify as bears (usually asking a simple question like: “Do you identify as a bear?” or “How would you identify yourself” and providing options). Here is one of the descriptions from Manley, Levitt, and Mosher (2008).
“The study was advertised through e-mails sent to listservs serving the bear community and to bear community group leaders. These postings asked for volunteers to participate in a study that sought to understand the relationships, values, and beliefs of bear-identified men.”
Another study from Moskovitz and colleagues recruited gay men from Craigslist (Australia, Canada, New Zealand, UK), IML (Chicago, 2008) and PrideFest (Milwaukee, 2008). One of the studies was done in China! Still, the concern you guys expressed that the findings may not apply to all bears is true and the authors of the systematic review mention this as a limitation:
“The total number of research studies and the small sample size within those studies may not reflect the true experiences of the men who identify as Bears. Researchers should be very cautious when interpreting the results of the studies.”
About risky behavior: I admit that I do not like when someone uses the words “risky,” “unhealthy,” or “low self-esteem” in the same sentence as my different identities (gay, bear, Hispanic, researcher, graduate student, poor). However, knowing that I am at a higher risk for diabetes because I am Hispanic has given me the power to take action and prevent it from happening. As I have mentioned, this review has that purpose; letting others know where to look to prevent bad things from happening. With this, let me show you an extract of the findings and then the recommendations from the review authors:
“When compared to other gay men, men who identified as Bears engaged in more diverse sexual acts like anilingus, fisting, asphyxiation, voyeurism, and exhibitionism (Moskowitz et al., 2013). Furthermore, men who identified as Bears were found to engage in UAS more often than other gay peer groups (Prestage et al., 2015; Willoughby et al., 2008).”
These sexual activities are characterized as “diverse” in the text not as perverse or wrong. Remember that guys who self-identify as bears were reporting these behaviors more often than other gay men (who do not identify as bears).
“Men who identified as Bears were found to engage in unsafe sexual activity, like UAS, anilingus, and fisting, more often than other gay men (Moskowitz et al., 2013; Willoughby et al., 2008). Healthcare providers can offer advice regarding protective measures to help decrease the chance of infection like the use of condoms and dental dams or receiving the hepatitis A vaccine. If a client engages in fisting, healthcare providers should teach clients the risks such as laceration or perforation of the rectum or colon, which can result in serious injury.”
We know that anal sex without a condom, anilingus, and fisting increase the chances of infections and injury in everyone. With the premise that men who identify as bears are reporting these behaviors more often than other groups, bears may face specific health needs that other groups may not. Even when people engage in fisting using as much caution as possible, fisting increases the risk of injury just like driving a car increases at speed limit increases your risk of injury compared to someone who does not drive a car or someone who drives very infrequently. The authors are not condemning or suggesting other clinicians to tell clients or patients to stop these activities. They are calling for clinicians to inform their patients about the risks. Patients can, then, decide what to do with the information.
About cause and effect: One of the issues that I remember from the podcast was the feeling that the authors of the review were implying that because we are bears all bears are unhealthy and have low self-esteem. The authors are not saying or implying that, but when articles like these are interpreted by other people who are not familiar with scientific writing, it could be interpreted in many ways. The systematic review and the articles it included are basically saying: “People who identify as bears report these characteristics more often or at higher rates than people who do not identify as bears.” In other words, researchers and clinicians read this as “people who identify as bears, on average, report higher BMI, more self-esteem issues, more masculinity traits, etc.” Other researchers usually know that studies like these cannot apply to everyone, but could be useful in identifying health needs. They also know the fact that being a bear does not cause lower self-esteem, higher masculinity, etc. A study answering that question would be impossible to do.
About BMI: Yes, BMI has a lot of flaws and has created unrealistic expectations and confusion. We cannot disregard that, time and time again, research has shown that higher BMIs usually categorized in the obese range are related to worse health outcomes especially if a sedentary lifestyle, smoking, excessive drinking, sleep problems, and other issues that go together are also present. The BMI is not a great measure of health, but it reflects other issues and works to take quick decisions when you are a doctor seeing a bunch of patients for 15 minutes at a time.
There is a lot that was left out from the Instinct article that is important to know. The language used in the systematic review was neutral and without bias against bears or gay individuals. It communicated a concern about potential and specific health needs of bears. The first author seems to identify as a bear (I did a quick search on google). The article recognizes that more research needs to be done to have a clearer picture about the health needs of bears. The review has been accepted for publication, but it is not the final product. Even though the results are unlikely to change, the suggestions and interpretations may be changed in the final version.
I hope I did not bore you too much with all this info. I did this because I care about these issues and I have been involved in research, clinical practice, and the LGBT community to offer a perspective you may have not had from any of these individual sources of information. If you have any comments or questions, I’d be happy to discuss them and answer them the best way possible.
In this week’s episode, it’s the GRAND FINALE! After 9 gag-worthy episodes, Gary and Damon spill the tea for one last time this season. Listen in as the guys live for the eleganza of the finale, from the photorific entrance to the show-stopping glamour of the crowning. Who takes it all home in the end?
In this episode of Cubs Out Loud Drag Race, Damon and Gary talk about the tenth episode of RuPaul’s Drag Race Season 7! In tonight’s episode, there’s murder on the dance floor in this mash up dance challenge. Listen in as the guys come face-two-face with their feelings on the sickening six queens left in the competition. Who is waltzing their way to the crown and who just might be two-stepping their way out the door?
[Gary] – While individual performance is important, teams matter…a lot
[Damon] – Where talent fails, rely on the other part (charisma, uniqueness, nerve)/You can’t hide
Thoughts on Untucked:
[Gary] – Hormones are raging; Practice makes perfect – careful where you point the blame finger
[Damon] – Why does no one feel safe?/Sex on the mind
Cooldown Topics
Take Aways:
[Gary] – Who’s confident and who isn’t
[Damon] – The “underdog” is growing on me, but I still have a favorite (new? maybe)
Snaps / Eyerolls:
[Gary] – Snaps for… RuPaul’s Runway Tearaway! and Michelle’s comment
[Gary] – Eyerolls for… Pearl’s dancing, Men with Breasts
[Damon] – Snaps for…Katya and Violet’s dance/Ginger’s lip sync/Violet’s confidence
[Damon] – Eyerolls for…Ginger’s lack of confidence/Trixie’s blame game/Trixie’s look during critique
Closing Thoughts:
[Gary] – Violet is the top contender, whether I like it or not. Based on the grid… Katya and Kennedy to Top 3 with Violet. Pearl and Ginger are in the bottom… UNLESS something changes.
[Damon] – Who do you think is going to win?
Bonus Material
RuPaul confesses to Michelle Visage in their “What’s the Tee?” podcast her feelings about what happened during that infamous awkward moment with Pearl earlier this season in Episode 5.
In this episode of Cubs Out Loud, we get a little dirty as we have another BEAR show (Bear Experience Action Readiness). In preparation of Midwest Bearfest, the guys talk about maintaining your health during a run. From keeping yourself from getting kennel cough to helping in the prevention of run drop, the cubs exchange some fluids information on how to better prepare for your health.
